Exclusive: Rhymefest Talks Honoring James Baldwin, Signing With Golden State Entertainment And His School Board Run In Chicago

To call the late James Baldwin an icon in literature, a legend when it comes to activism and/or a godfather to the civil rights movement would be understatements in describing the true impact that he left on Black culture.

To read his debut novel, the 1953 semi-autobiographical masterpiece Go Tell It on the Mountain, is to dive into the mind of a then-29-year-old NYC native who had so much to say about the cultural significance of his upbringing and used so many eloquent words to get it all out. What resulted was a fruitful literary career that spanned for decades until his untimely death on December 1, 1987, and even spawned his well-known foray into civil rights activism that helped shape history when it comes to our views on masculinity, sexuality, race, and class in America all at once.

And finally, as we found out last week during the anniversary celebration of James Baldwin’s would-be 100th birthday (August 2), his work has influenced countless of other scholars and intellects that’ve preceded him over the years. One in particular is GRAMMY and Oscar winner Rhymefest, who back in February released his third studio album, James & Nikki: A Conversation. It’s his first music project in 14 years and first under his new label deal at Golden State Entertainment, and as the album title suggests is fully inspired and incorporates clips from Baldwin’s two-hour conversation with fellow pioneering activist Nikki Giovanni that aired on the Black-oriented variety series SOUL! by WNET (predecessor to PBS) back in 1971.

Rhymefest proved to be the perfect person to help honor Baldwin for his posthumous centennial celebration, and he did just that with a panel discussion that preceded a performance at The New York Public Library’s Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture located in Harlem. It was all to commemorate the center’s new JIMMY! God’s Black Revolutionary Mouth exhibition on display now through the end of Black History Month next year. It all commenced later in the day at the prestigious Lincoln Center, where Rhymefest set up shop in the venue’s Alice Tully Hall to perform his album in its entirety.

You already know it wasn’t a question to pull up when the Chi-Town native personally extended an invite to check it out in-person and even sit down for our own conversation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

RELATED: James Baldwin At 100 – His Genius Influenced Black Musicians

In our chat with the man behind some of your favorite hits by ‘the old Kanye’ (see: “Jesus Walks”), not to mention the guy who helped Common and John Legend achieve Academy Award-winning status with “Glory,” we touched on everything from Baldwin’s influence on his own work, future plans on the Golden State Entertainment roster and his admirable aspirations to run for a school board seat in Chicago this November.

What can’t this man do?!

Black America Web: First and foremost, starting from the beginning, can you recall your first experience with the original conversation between James Baldwin and Nikki Giovanni and how it influenced you to make a whole album around it?
Che “Rhymefest” Smith: Ok, so I don’t “doom scroll”; I “knowledge scroll” [Laughs] I was scrolling and I see Nikki Giovanni holding James Baldwin to account. He says things like, “You can’t tell a man what to do; you have to suggest it,” and she said, “No! I demand that you be a man; that’s your ego speaking! I demand that you be a man!” I was like, ‘Who is this speaking to James Baldwin like this?!’ [Laughs] I started going deeper and deeper, excavating and exploring. Then I said, ‘Wow — because of the way people receive information today in soundbites, very few people will actually go listen to a two-hour conversation and even understand the context of the time [James and Nikki] were in during that conversation.’ That’s not even considering the alchemy of what they were doing with the courageousness within the context of that time! I started looking at it, like, how do I bring this and make it contemporary, accessible and ultimately bring the ancestors back through our expressions.

How did you then go about deconstructing it to make the conversation your own?
I made the songs around the conversation, but I also made them around my insecurities and flaws. I knew that the only way James Baldwin and Nikki Giovanni could work in hip-hop is if you’re vulnerable and open up. With this project, I realized I myself had to open up. Bringing the women in as my “co-authors” [Editor’s Note: Each song on ‘James & Nikki: A Conversation’ features a female emcee to match the “Nikki” energy to Rhymefest’s “Baldwin” energy] was an essential part; If I bring the Baldwin, someone has to bring the Nikki to challenge me on my blind side. It came out when making songs like “What’s In It For Me?” [officially titled “Who You Talking To?”], where my future self is questioning my present self about how I’m treating myself.

 

 

We see that even in “Pop,” where you’re talking about the culture of music right now and how Black culture influences it in various aspects. Even the way the word ‘pop’ is used throughout is so significant.
James Baldwin led the way with that type of courage. Think about it: James Baldwin was questioning the church in the ’60s. He was being a gay Black man who not only questioned the church but also questioned the country, Blackness and what “being white” was. In his eyes, the worst thing you could’ve ever did was call yourself white; you doomed yourself the minute you did that, and anybody who accepts being Black from someone who deemed you as that is doomed too! Baldwin would deconstruct every sentence, every world, to deprogram you and then leave you deconstructed in order to rebuild yourself.

Interestingly enough, you make for such a good auditor to channel that energy. What was it like curating the selection of women that became the Nikki’s to your Baldwin on the album?
I believe that the whole thing for an artist is to make the audience ask questions of themselves and the person making them question themselves. For me, doing this project came down to figuring out how can I present something to the audience that they literally must think about. You can’t even listen to this project without some sort of consideration of your own life and the world you live in. It had to be done if I was to use Baldwin’s voice.

How do you envision someone taking this body of work and incorporating it into other similar Baldwin-related forms of media, like the JIMMY! God’s Black Revolutionary Mouth exhibition that we’re here for today?
I would like for viewers of the JIMMY! exhibition to take some headphones and breeze through with James & Nikki playing. [The album is] only 30 minutes, which was important for me to make a full project, a full nourishment, in just a half hour. It’s important to me that people of this generation continue to let the ancestors come through us. If we don’t, they die. Better yet, if we don’t we die.

 

 

With this being the start to a series of concept albums from you, where does Baldwin’s legacy come into play in terms of influencing your future on the roster of Golden State Entertainment?
I’m so happy that you brought up Golden State Entertainment; I’m proud that GSE was the company that took on such a heavy project and agreed to put something out to entertain as well as make impact in the community. Steph [Curry] puts butts in seats, and [the Golden State brand] is already an entertainment juggernaut. To say ‘Now we’re going to do documentaries,’ or ‘Now we’re going to do music, books and things that enhance the quality of community’ was super important. I’m beyond honored that Golden State chose James & Nikki to release right on the precipice of Black History Month and going into James Baldwin 100. It couldn’t be sweeter.

Bringing it all full circle for you, would you say James Baldwin’s legacy, particularly the literary portion of his career, influenced your foray into running for the school board seat in Chicago this November?
Yes! On this project, there’s a part where James says “A teacher who does not teach is not a teacher.” Then they start going into the definition of the living word, to which Baldwin ends by saying “No tyrant in history could read, but they all burned the books.” I said, “We’re dealing with one of those right now!” [Laughs]

How prophetic.

 

Happy birthday week to the late, great James Baldwin! Keep scrolling for a few images we took at the JIMMY! God’s Black Revolutionary Mouth exhibition at the Schomburg Center in Harlem, on display now through February 28, 2025:

 

 

 

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